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TOPIC: From TotalScan to 3in1

From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 1 month ago #11650

  • MarsArtis
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I'll be soon wetting my new EliteTi2+3in1 sounder which is replacing my precious EliteTi+TotalScan.

As said in the past I'll be mapping saltwater, quite torbid which will not be deeper than 20 meters.

Close to the shoreline the coast has rock nails and boulders that here and there make the depth suddenly raise up to 1 meter in certain spots.

For these reason I do prefer to set depth manually to a fixed depth (15 meters) instead of leaving AUTO. THIS to avoid unpleasant variations both on sonar/down image and in sideimaging in particular.

What are your thoughts about this?

Second question is about 3in1 performances over TotalScan.
With previous setup I had pretty nice SI on 455 using Deep water preset (as suggested by TeamColibri to make sounder issue a more powerful pulse than with other presets).
While 800 frequency gave clearer and sharper profiles of some underwater features but way too dark.

Can I expect better performances with 800 khz using 3in1 or should I keep using the 455 for side imaging purposes?
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From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 3 weeks ago #11672

  • DannyGeysen
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You easily can double the range using 800 kHz compared to the Totalscan. I have seen really good screenshots with ranges up to 40 m (on 800 kHz)
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From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 3 weeks ago #11676

  • MarsArtis
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Right yesterday I went out for the first time with the new toy.

Have to say that 455 3in1 is far way better than TotalScan. Really clear and crisp images. Well contrasted and bright.
Left preset to General use and Auto to gain and 40 meters on the sides (max 15 meters depth)


About 800: used gain on Auto+2 but images resulted way too dark. Both at close distance and obviously on far end of the scan area.

Surface filters for both were off.
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From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 2 weeks ago #11682

  • MarsArtis
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DannyGeysen wrote:
You easily can double the range using 800 kHz compared to the Totalscan. I have seen really good screenshots with ranges up to 40 m (on 800 kHz)

Shots made in fresh water or salt water?
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From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 2 weeks ago #11683

  • DannyGeysen
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Fresh water.
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From TotalScan to 3in1 1 year 1 week ago #11694

  • MarsArtis
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Just want to have a deeper technical debate, hopefully.
Here and there I'm seeing people complaining about 3in1 active imaging sounder performances with downscan.
Most people argue and regret that it's not possible to choose frequency and that it's stuck at 800 khz and therefore that quality of the image fades as soon as water depth in salt water goes down under 20 meters (let's say about 7 feet).

This said I've not experienced such "issue". I mean to me it seems that 3in1 works more or less like TotalScan. If I want 455 I just select that frequency in SIDESCAN and it sets accordingly. The same with 800.
Sonar logs seems confirming what I say but people argue that even if the log states Downscan it's 455 it's actually 800. This makes no sense to me.

Attached are just two examples of sonarlogs recorded using an EliteTi2 7" (SW release20.0-63.1.291) + 3in1
Attachments:
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From TotalScan to 3in1 5 months 4 days ago #11986

  • WhereTheFishAre
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MarsArtis wrote:
I'll be soon wetting my new EliteTi2+3in1 sounder which is replacing my precious EliteTi+TotalScan.

As said in the past I'll be mapping saltwater, quite torbid which will not be deeper than 20 meters.

Close to the shoreline the coast has rock nails and boulders that here and there make the depth suddenly raise up to 1 meter in certain spots.

For these reason I do prefer to set depth manually to a fixed depth (15 meters) instead of leaving AUTO. THIS to avoid unpleasant variations both on sonar/down image and in sideimaging in particular.

What are your thoughts about this?

Second question is about 3in1 performances over TotalScan.
With previous setup I had pretty nice SI on 455 using Deep water preset (as suggested by TeamColibri to make sounder issue a more powerful pulse than with other presets).
While 800 frequency gave clearer and sharper profiles of some underwater features but way too dark.

Can I expect better performances with 800 khz using 3in1 or should I keep using the 455 for side imaging purposes?


MarsArtis,
I, too, went from TotalScan (Ti5) to 3in1. My 3in1 is the Active Imaging with the HDS 7, though.

With Sidescan, I found that my Ti5 (5" Elite Ti) Totalscan worked very well with 455mHZ but VERY dark with the 800mHZ. I did open up my transducer cover (it's mounted on my Hobie Kayak) and found a bunch of sand inside the cover. I'm curious if that sand affects the 800 mHZ, since it didn't seem to affect the 455mHZ? Before I could try it out, I already had swapped the 3in1 with the HDS7. I was able to use both freqs, but haven't been able to evaluate if I can see a disernable difference in my HDS7 or the Reefmaster software.

What I have found is that with my 3in1, I get random blurry spots on the sonar log while maintaining course and speed. I didn't get this with my Ti5 at 455mHz. the blurry spots mean that a full section of that log is blurry while the rest of the section is clear, all connected on the same sonar log and no change in course or speed.

Have you experienced this with your 3in1?

I'm curious to see what else you've found in your trials or if you have any suggestions for the following types of seabeds:
-2ft-8ft saltwater bays
-2ft - 40ft lakes
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From TotalScan to 3in1 5 months 3 days ago #11992

  • MarsArtis
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WhereTheFishAre wrote:
I, too, went from TotalScan (Ti5) to 3in1. My 3in1 is the Active Imaging with the HDS 7, though.

With Sidescan, I found that my Ti5 (5" Elite Ti) Totalscan worked very well with 455mHZ but VERY dark with the 800mHZ. I did open up my transducer cover (it's mounted on my Hobie Kayak) and found a bunch of sand inside the cover. I'm curious if that sand affects the 800 mHZ, since it didn't seem to affect the 455mHZ? Before I could try it out, I already had swapped the 3in1 with the HDS7. I was able to use both freqs, but haven't been able to evaluate if I can see a disernable difference in my HDS7 or the Reefmaster software.

Have read here and there about other people with issues related to garbage/sand in the cover. Since 455 has more power than 800 it does make sense that the higher freq suffers more from theese debries. But once cleaned you should benefit on 455 too.
What I have found is that with my 3in1, I get random blurry spots on the sonar log while maintaining course and speed. I didn't get this with my Ti5 at 455mHz. the blurry spots mean that a full section of that log is blurry while the rest of the section is clear, all connected on the same sonar log and no change in course or speed.
Have you experienced this with your 3in1?
How much blurry it appears for you? I've not experienced this issue.
I'm curious to see what else you've found in your trials or if you have any suggestions for the following types of seabeds:
-2ft-8ft saltwater bays
-2ft - 40ft lakes
I only go at sea and the area I scan is very heterogeneous. let's say that most shallow area are between -2 and - 8ft and other may arrive deepr as -50 with some rocks here and there on sand/mud seabed. Random peeks rising up to -3.
Since it's quite always torbid due to wave currents that make the fine mud particles raise from the bottom I keep using 455, with sonar preset to deepwater. With fixed water depth for 2d sonar and fixed SI width so to better stitch the mosaic.
Last Edit: 5 months 3 days ago by MarsArtis.
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From TotalScan to 3in1 5 months 3 days ago #11994

  • WhereTheFishAre
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I'll try next time using the "Deep Water" setting. There are so many settings on this thing that I could waste a year trying to tune it! The blurry pics are attached. Matt offered some suggestions in the forum topic I just started under "Support." Maybe he can see what my file says and I can adjust from there. Thanks for the response.
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